Ep. 000 The 2025 Edupreneur Revisit

In this Joey x Malia podcast episode, we finally dive into our dynamic journey and collaborative efforts that have run the drjoeyliu.com education business for the past year and a half.

Malia introduces herself, detailing her journey from being my high school student to becoming an integral part of our business.

Our discussion covers the pivotal moments of 2025, from the emotional highs and lows of launching new programs to the deep-rooted faith and unshakable belief we have in each other.

We reflect on the launch of 'Sovereign Storyteller,' our handling of unforeseen challenges, and the unexpected creation of 'Ancestral Wealth' with Simone Seol.

We also discuss our plans for 2026, including the new 'Space Makers' program aimed at helping others create radical and transformational educational experiences.

This episode is a conversation between friends/collaborators about growth, community, and the unwavering support that fuels our collective mission.

Transcript:

All right. Malia, here we are—the much-anticipated Joey x Malia podcast that we’ve been talking about for so long. We have to introduce you. People who are in my programs know who you are because you’ve been here from the very beginning, but why don’t you tell people who are just landing in our world right now who you are and who you are to me.

Okay. I am Malia. I’m a mother. I’m a hard worker. I’m dedicated to everything that I do. I have a three-year-old daughter who is my everything. And who I am to you… so look, you guys, I’ve known Joey for almost 11 years. She was my high school teacher—the first teacher who ever really noticed me and tried to have real conversations with me outside of “you need to be in class.”

That’s wild, because you were not hard to notice. Are you sure that’s a true statement?

Yes. You were the one teacher who I would have real personal conversations with. So Joey was my teacher who then became my mentor, my friend, my best friend, my mother—my all-in-one inclusive person that I could go to for anything and everything. It wasn’t like school ended and the relationship ended. No, school ended and she made sure that the relationship continued.

She came to me in a time where I was going through a lot and was like, “Hey, you want to work for me?” And I thought, the timing is perfect. I was leaving one job—or in the middle of deciding if I was leaving or staying—and I just felt like the energy of being there wasn’t right. The energy of being around Joey was just perfect and what I wanted to do moving forward. So it aligned, and now we’re here.

First of all, you give me way too many props. I can’t imagine it being any other way. It just feels so regular to me. But you know, I love you from the bottom of my heart. I never even think about how much time passes, because you and I can both go into introverted modes where time doesn’t exist. If I love you, I love you forever. Time isn’t a thing.

When I was starting my business, one reason Malia popped up so strongly in my mind was because you really helped me run things back in the classroom. There was so much I couldn’t have done without you. You were always refilling my water bottle—that’s the first example I think of because I drank a lot of water. That’s the attentiveness of Malia. You even made me a coupon book. Was that when I was pregnant with Kamali?

No, I had already graduated. I was a broke high schooler and wanted to do something for you. So I made a coupon book.

I love a coupon book. People put them away, but I used the heck out of mine. Those things were very valuable to me. You became my right hand—my student, my TA. You were always helping with BSU, the snack bar, organizing things. You learned how I worked and always filled in the gaps because you knew my attention was pulled in many directions. Coming to start a business, you can’t put a price tag on that type of support.

As a business owner and educator, I still create curriculum and teach, but there’s admin work too. Bringing someone on who knows me, who doesn’t have to be trained in how my brain works, is so valuable. It’s why I thought of you. And yes—it was divine timing when it aligned for you to come join me.

It was a big leap: a new business, hiring someone right away, especially when online businesses usually have little overhead. But my focus was always, “How can I pay Malia first?”

I even said, “You don’t have to pay me. When we get there, you can.” But Joey said, “No, Malia, I’m paying you.”

You have a child, you need to support yourself. At some point, it can feel exploitative to take free labor. There’s something holy about honoring someone’s time and effort and being motivated to generate the revenue to take care of your people. So essentially, we started the business together in summer 2024.

This podcast is to walk through what 2025 meant for our work, business, and vision—the education we’re putting out, which couldn’t exist without Malia.

So let’s take it back to the start of 2025. What do you remember about that time?

It felt so long ago. We had worked the second half of 2024 toward launching a program called Be the Voice. We pulled the plug on it right at the end of the year. That was hard—we had enrolled students—but we were so new and didn’t realize how premature it was to launch something at that scale. The fact that we got any enrollees was amazing. But I got the advice: if you don’t want to burn out, put a pin in that.

So in late fall, we pivoted those people into one-on-ones instead of a group program. Going into 2025, I was in hibernation mode.

I felt like even though all that happened, I always thought, “It’s going to be okay.” Maybe we paused so I could keep learning. The hardest part for me was patience—learning to slow down. So I started 2025 thinking, things are going to align how they need to.

We needed that slow-down year, that processing season. And comparing now to then—it’s a whole different world.

A huge shift. And money can’t buy that sense of trust and belief you had in me. You had less hours, less pay, more uncertainty, but complete faith in our vision. That solidarity meant everything.

Well, it comes down to the fact that—you saved me. In high school I tore my ACL in the game I was being scouted at. When I came back, I became your TA because you made it happen with my counselor. I thought, “Why is she going so hard for me?” But you helped me through it—you acknowledged my pain, but also said, “You’re going to be okay.” That faith is why I have so much belief in you. It’s a full circle. No matter where this business goes, I’ll always think—we’re fine, Joey’s got it.

I remember you hobbling around with your cast up to your hip. And I still sent you on copy runs, because you needed to feel useful!

Exactly. And that’s why I’ve never felt doubt. Joey has a goal, she’s determined, and when she’s determined—we’re getting there.

I just feel so honored to have you say that. There were a lot of rollercoaster moments in 2025 after Be the Voice was put aside. I was working on Find Yourself Here—the book—and learning as I went. You were learning websites and edits, I was learning publishing.

When the first draft of the workbook was ready, I put it up on my stories and got 20 people to be test readers. My audience was small then. My husband, Michael, and you both said, “Why are you giving out your drafts for free?”

I agreed—but Joey knew what she was doing.

At the time, growing community was my priority. Community is a currency more valuable than money. I was still testing curriculum, refining my teaching, and finding out what kind of teacher I was becoming in this online space. I needed people’s voices to shape my work.

You worked so much on that in Canva—probably way too perfectionist—but we had the luxury of time.

Yes, I remember thinking, “When will we be done?”

We worked on it through June. The digital version came out in March, we thought of printing it for Amazon, but I didn’t like the print quality. So now we only have the digital version.

So let’s pick up the pieces—a vision check. What was our 2025 vision and how does it tie into the bigger one?

The bigger vision is giving back to the community in ways that uplift and hold each other accountable, while ensuring everyone gains something—not “I need to be better,” but “we need to come together.” Our goal was to build our community base, to show people we’re not about money—we’re about connection and reciprocal growth.

Yes. The bigger vision has always been to create a space that disrupts hierarchies. Not about privilege or power, but giving voices in the global majority tools to transmit their knowledge. Online spaces allow for ancestral and cultural wisdom that traditional systems silence.

I’ve taught people how to use their voices for years, so this is a natural extension. Money is a tool, not the goal—it’s about redistributing it to build things for the community.

So anchoring in 2025, we sowed the seeds of these communities. The big project was launching Sovereign Storyteller and organizing the Oral Expressions 10-year reunion. You handled that reunion while I experimented with this “mini” course. Which became not-so-mini—a full seven-module course with workshops.

I thought it was going to be small!

Yes—and that’s funny now.

Looking back, I think my past self gave my future self the gift of approach: being experimental. Be the Voice hadn’t panned out, and I needed to heal my nervous system’s relationship with launching. I told myself—no pressure, just three students. I designed my launch experience to feel joyful and craveable, so I’d want to do it again, not dread it.

And you ended up with 23 students.

Yes—20 more than my goal.

And I said you’d get 20! The “Malia number.”

Explain the Malia number.

It’s the number that intuitively comes to me for how many people we’ll reach—one number that sticks out in my mind. I even do the math on days left and target enrollment. And we always surpass it.

It’s neuroscience of belief. The number directs our energy. It creates micro actions toward the vision. Sovereign Storyteller went smoothly, and that community is still thriving. We relaunched in fall 2025 after a summer break, while something else appeared—something we could never have planned: Ancestral Wealth.

At first, I didn’t take it as serious. Joey was talking about it in summer, still deciding. I let her process, then by September, we were fully in it.

Yes. Simone Seol and I began talking about teaching something together. The concept—“Be who your ancestors told you you are”—came to me, and it all took off. What began as a small workshop became a massive, graduate-level course that refined both our work. It was bigger than any one person’s vision.

Our teams merged into a family. It was such a profound co-creation. And even though I thought I’d teach about wealth redistribution 20 years from now, my ancestors said, “No, start now.”

Running both Sovereign Storyteller and Ancestral Wealth side by side was intense—but possible because of our team.

It was amazing to see—across locations, we shared the same vision. And watching participants create and grow was so fulfilling.

Hearing that makes me emotional. If you’re proud, I feel affirmed. I keep my biggest critics closest because they know my potential.

Yes. My husband thinks I sound harsh sometimes, but Joey knows what I mean—it’s honest feedback built on love.

Exactly. When the foundation is love, truth has space to live.

Recording this podcast right after closing Sovereign Storyteller’s second cycle feels full circle. You pray and pour intention into your work, hoping people find liberation, joy, and self-trust. And when you see it happening—people publishing, creating, leading—it’s deeply fulfilling.

I don’t even have a salary yet—but Malia’s salary is the business’s priority. The money is never the focus—it’s sustaining community.

I want to pay Malia six figures, hire more people, build six-figure jobs for those who never thought they could have them.

Six figures felt like a fairytale to me. But working for Joey made me rethink that. Why did I think I couldn’t make that? Through her workbooks and content, I’m learning and growing too. This job is fulfilling on so many levels.

I’ve lived so many lives, and I’m full of stories. I love being a little mysterious—but one day I’ll tell them all.

I still learn new things about you every day!

So, wrapping up—how did 2025 set us up for 2026?

It set us up through community-building and learning. We fine-tuned processes, learned when to slow down or start. Now we’re growing with intention. We have two new programs coming up.

One is Sovereignty—for alumni—bringing in teachers from within our community, paying them to teach. It’s about circulating wisdom and income.

The other is Space Makers, coming in the fall, focused on helping people design educational programs. Many entrepreneurs are teachers without realizing it. This program helps them build radical, transformational curriculums and learning spaces. Teaching the teachers how to teach.

That’s been part of my mission since the classroom days. My finals always made students teach a lesson—to build confidence, pedagogy, and voice. Many of my former students are educators now because of that experience.

Exactly—and that’s why this next step is so exciting. It gives people structure and confidence.

Yes, it’s about helping them create programs that feel alive and change the world.

So—Space Makers is coming in fall. Ancestral Wealth continues. 2025 was our year of experimentation. 2026 is about growth, systems, expansion.

And Malia is growing too—transitioning from part-time to full-time by summer.

I’m so excited. I told Joey, I wanted to be a present mom, working from home, doing something meaningful. Working for Joey fulfills that dream—something I thought was unreachable.

And it’s reciprocal. I couldn’t do this without you. You’re 50% of the brain. You solve problems I overthink.

Working for you feels so right—it’s everything I wanted.

This year is it—the year that positions us to expand even more. Maybe in-person retreats. Maybe Hawaii. 2026 might just be the retreat year.

Everything we say we’re going to do—we make it happen.

Absolutely. This has been amazing. I’m so glad we had this conversation. It’s a beautiful closure to 2025 and opening to 2026.

Thank you for sitting and talking with me, Malia. Thank you all for tuning in to this revival of our podcast. More episodes are coming—some solo, some with Malia, some with guests. Stay tuned and subscribe to stay in the loop.

Until next time—we’ll see you later.

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